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  • brucek2 - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    What are you supposed to do when an ostensibly independent benchmark is so easily skewed by a single component it's not even expressly designed to test, as is the case when the PCMark scores inflate on account of an SSD or 3DMark gets hung up on processor power?


    Neither of those examples seems so bad to me? If PCMark is supposed to indicate overall PC responsiveness, then seeing a noticeable boost from a SSD seems correct? And we all know its possible for CPU to be the limiting factor in graphic performance depending on the game and graphic settings, especially at low resolutions like 1024x768?
    Reply
  • tipoo - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    PCmark I somewhat agree with you, but 3D mark is supposed to represent the current gaming situation. Most games now are far more GPU bound than CPU bound, and 3DMark seems to represent that the opposite way. Reply
  • JarredWalton - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    The problem with PCMark is that while there are plenty of tasks where an SSD helps, there are also a lot of others where it doesn't do much. Gaming for me feels 99% the same with the game installed to a 1TB HDD vs. a fast SF-1200 SSD. (That's what my current gaming PC is using, incidentally.) Some things are dramatically faster, like installing Adobe Photoshop literally took 1/3 the time vs. an HDD, but while lots of stuff feels snappier there are too many things where an SSD doesn't help for a "system benchmark" to improve by nearly 100%. At least, that's my opinion on the matter. Reply
  • scook9 - Monday, April 04, 2011 - link

    The problem is that they are using 3DMark benches that are OLD

    For modern systems they should be using 3DMark Vantage at the default Performance settings (1280x1024) and 3DMark 11 at its default performance settings (1280x720) as these are the only settings that anyone will care about and compare to (also only "Official" results for ranking in both hwbot and ORB). Drop 03, 05 and even 06 as they are all notoriously CPU bound (as were the games nearly a decade ago....). Modern drivers also do not optimize for those older programs.

    And something I found curious.....if they are so in bed with corsair.....why use a 570LC and not an H70?!
    Reply
  • Solidstate89 - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    ...a Silverstone Fortress FT03 box in the first image on page 1. That is certainly one of the more interesting cases I've seen come out of Silverstone. Reply
  • Rick83 - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Yeah, currently planning my SB build in that (2600K, asus pro board, 2x4GB vengeance 1866 MHz RAM, a 6950 (oh but which?) a Yasya, and a 500W Enermax Modu 87+ (or maybe a seasonic X-FL?) as well as the obligatory slot-in sony optiarc...)
    Waiting until I can get it for less than a 1000 euros, or an insanely awesome Z68 board sweetens the deal...
    Of course, the last review I read insinuated that the fans used in the case are low quality and will have to be replaced. And then there's the question which cooler layout for the graphics will be ideal....
    Not quite a done deal yet.
    Reply
  • tsekh - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    " Even with the Asetek liquid cooler running full bore (and oh how it runs full bore), you'll see temperatures are really quite high compared to other machines. At first it looked like my old nemesis, the Viscount von Lazyoverclocking, was rearing his ugly head, but a quick trip into UEFI revealed a fairly tuned overclock, complete with offset voltage. If anything it just looks like this particular chip needs a healthy amount of voltage pumped into it to hit high speeds;"

    No. That's definitely lazy overclocking. With Asus P8P67 Deluxe, my 2600k is running stable also at 4.5Ghz with offset voltage +0.03V, and the min/max CPU voltage I get using this setting is 0.984/1.288V. Most 2600k can do this speed at max voltage lower than 1.32V and a lot lower can do it at lower than 1.3V. Comapred to the max CPU voltage of 1.42V, one can expect at least 10C degree difference in load temperature, given a non-rubbish cooling system.
    Reply
  • LtGoonRush - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    "given a non-rubbish cooling system." That right there is the problem, commercial water cooling products simply aren't even remotely competitive with air coolers. I've been harping on this for a long time, but it's true: water cooling is obsolete in the face of heatpipes, which provide better cooling, lower costs, lower noise, and higher reliability. This build uses the Asetek OEM version of the Corsair H70, for nearly $30 less a Thermalright Silver Arrow would have provided far better cooling with fans running at <1200rpm, and you don't have to worry about a pump potentially failing. Reply
  • The_Assimilator - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    @tsekh

    If you know anything about overclocking then you'll know that not all CPUs are created equal. Just because you got a chips that clocks well doesn't mean Origin did. I've personally seen a 2600K that refuses to exceed 4.2GHz regardless of the volts/cooling applied.

    @LtGoonRush

    "commercial water cooling products simply aren't even remotely competitive with air coolers"

    Wrong. I replaced a TRUE 120 with an H50 (using the same fans) and the H50 is cooler. Maybe if you're comparing commercial watercoolers to high-end aircoolers that statement is valid, but then the comparison isn't.

    "a Thermalright Silver Arrow would have provided far better cooling with fans running at <1200rpm"

    Except that the Silver Arrow is absolutely huge and monstrously heavy, which means that shipping it pre-installed is a bad idea, which makes it a non-option for a boutique PC that's going to be transported who knows how far.
    Reply
  • tsekh - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    @ The_Assimilator

    If you know anything about overclocking then you should know there is a humongous difference 1.28V and 1.42V. If that particular 2600k can't OC to 4.5Ghz, it just can't and that's very rare. But if it can do 4.5Ghz, it definitely can do it at much lower voltage. 1.42V is simply a huge overkill. Also, you have to be either extremely unlucky, or simply a complete idiot, to fail to OC a 2600k past 4.2Ghz. Most people can do 4.2Ghz with everything on auto with their P67 motherboards. I hope it has to do with your bad luck.
    Reply
  • JarredWalton - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    And I've got an i7-965 Extreme that won't run reliably at 4.0GHz without excessive voltage. It's very likely in my experience overclocking that they needed the voltage boost to get 4.5GHz stable.

    I remember the old Celeron 300A days: "All of these can overclock to 450MHz just by changing the bus, and then you have the equivalent of a Pentium II 450 for less than half the price!"

    Guess what? Between myself and a couple friends, we bought about ten 300A CPUs. One would do 504MHz (112MHz FSB), one more would run at 450MHz without trouble. Two would boot 450 but were unstable if you wanted the PC to run 24/7. The remaining six all topped out at 374MHz (83 FSB). I've seen similar things on a lot of "guaranteed overclocks" during the years, and never mind the "100% stable" overclocks I've had that started having problems after 6-12 months.

    Actually, that last is one reason to buy a system from some place like Origin. If you get their 3-year warranty and the system overclock starts going AWOL after a year or 18 months, you're still covered. I've had at least five somewhat recent CPUs peter out and die on me after running apparently fine for a year or more. (Pentium D 820, Pentium D 920, Athlon 3200+, Athlon X2 3800+, and Athlon X2 5000+ all come to mind.) So basically, I support what Assimilator said, which is in essence: YMMV.
    Reply
  • tsekh - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    As you said, yours is a i7-965. For the i7-2600k's, 4Ghz OC is like a walk in the park in gneral. Reply
  • erple2 - Tuesday, April 05, 2011 - link

    Sometimes, the park is filled with dog poo, however. So that walk isn't so easy to do without being very careful, and upping the voltage.

    Again, not all i7-2600k's will run at 4 GHz with stock everything. Statistics tells me quite well that you can't say "all" without testing every single last one out there. Which I'm pretty sure you haven't. Unless you're that jerk that broke into my house the other day to test my i7-2600K.

    If you continue to claim how it's easy to do for "most" of these SB chips, then I'll continue to pick nits about how "most" or "many" or "almost all" does not equal "all".
    Reply
  • Chris Simmo - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    @tsekh
    I have built 4 i7 2600K systems @ 4.8GHz and have been able to build them with as little as 1.28v peak and load line on regular as well, but yes there are difficult chips. The worst 1 has had to have 1.42v with load line on high. 4 aren’t very many, but they are fluctuating a bit in voltage with high overclocks applied. The CPU’s had all power saving features enabled too. All C states
    I work for a little computer shop and our flag ship 'off the shelf' system uses a Sabertooth P67, 16GB RAM, 120Gb Corsair SSD, 2TB Storage drive, Bluray combo, a HD6970 in an Antec 900 2 case with a GW 900w PSU and a Corsair H70.
    If the Asetek cooler is the OEM cooler, those temps don't seem to compare to the Corsair H70. Even on the 1.42v i7 2600k system under Linx load only got to 68c max Core temps (not package) I'm guessing there is something different somewhere then......May not have to do with the cooler, maybe aircon or something
    Reply
  • BigBadBiologist - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    I'm not sure why, but the Rosewill card reader sticks out like a sore thumb to me. Reply
  • tipoo - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Its brushed metal whereas everything else is matte Reply
  • headbox - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    So what exactly is a computer boutique? A shop that assembles off the shelf parts? Does Origin manufacture anything original at all? And $2,000+ for a cheap plastic case with kiddie windows and bling lights? Wow... PC makers just haven't caught on yet. Reply
  • wumpus - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    If I really want to feel old, I'll just think about how long Alienware has been in business. I think back when I bought an 386sx from ALR, they actually designed the thing, and often had some of the fastest machines around (whitebox computers caught up within a year or so). Reply
  • KoolAidMan1 - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    The Corsair 600T is actually a really good case. What case do you suggest that they use? I personally have a hard time recommending much outside of the Corsair and Silverstone cases. Reply
  • rscoot - Monday, April 04, 2011 - link

    Personally, I'm more of a fan of the Corsair 800D than the 600T. Reply
  • KoolAidMan1 - Monday, April 04, 2011 - link

    I am too, I own an 800D myself. That said, the 600T is also a good case. It has quite a few of the features of the 800D, things like its cable management, and it is very well built. It is a pretty great deal given that you can find it for around $140 on Amazon. Reply
  • bigboxes - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    I'm tired of this kind of posts. You know this is not geared to the normal pc builder on AnandTech. It's geared towards those that can't or won't do it them selves. Yeah, I'm one of them, but egads the horror that someone may actually make a profit on putting together a computer. Why would they make their own parts. They put together the computer with quality parts. What else could you ask for? Your complaint that they don't make the motherboard? The cpu? The case? I'm at a loss to understand your complaint. I just checked out their website. You can choose a windowless design. Still got complaints? Then nothing is going to satisfy you. I am with you, but I do not make stupid posts knocking others for doing so. Why? Because I'm the exception. I'm the builder. Most are not. I would have more respect for someone who bought one of these than a Dell or HP. Not everyone is an idiot because they don't build their own pc. Reply
  • ArKritz - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Lift with your legs, man! :p Reply
  • tacobff - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Starts at 1337$
    Awesome.
    Reply
  • Ninhalem - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Took a look at the options they offer for all the different components and frankly it is overwhelming the number of options they have. I haven't seen anything like that ever before. If I was going to do something like that, I would need to sit down with the Anandtech GPU bench system to choose the correct gpu configuration because there are so many options.

    As for what other case I could choose? The Cooler Master Cosmos case comes to mind. Personally I think that case is a lot better than the Corsair case, but that's a personal preference.
    Reply
  • Xorp - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Anyone know the make and model of that SATA Hot-swap bay? Reply
  • Dustin Sklavos - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    I don't have the model number offhand, but it's a Lian-Li dual drive hot-swap bay if that helps. Reply
  • ooiman92 - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Starting at $1,337
    I LOLed :P
    Reply
  • skyshiro - Saturday, April 02, 2011 - link

    Where on Earth did they get the side panel? No one is selling one, I'd love to get a 600T if I could get my hands on a side panel for one. Reply
  • JarredWalton - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    "Origin is also in a privileged position with Corsair and as a result are among the first to get their hands on the new windowed side panel which they make use of by illuminating the internals with strips of white LED lights."

    I'm guessing Corsair will make the window available at retail at some point, but right now you'd have to roll your own.
    Reply
  • MeanBruce - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    The windowed side panel is available NOW for the 600T at the Corsair website. Personally I would go with the new Corsair Obsidian 650D chassis, with it's understated elegance, it's exceptionally urbane. I have one in my office!;) Reply
  • HilbertSpace - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    First SC 2 graph is wrong - no way the Puget system should be leading. Reply
  • Dustin Sklavos - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    Graph is likely correct. In my experience Radeons have less CPU overhead in SC2. Couple that with the fact that the Genesis is driving two video cards instead of one and it does balance out. Reply
  • iamezza - Sunday, April 03, 2011 - link

    Another good review thanks Dustin!

    If you are going to keep reviewing these massive boutique systems maybe you could claim a gym membership as a tax deduction :)
    Reply
  • Alex99a - Monday, April 04, 2011 - link

    quoting...
    "I can tell you that the packaging was decidedly American and absolute overkill...."

    Well, now what is THAT supposed to mean? Please explain to me the concept of "decidedly American". I come to AnandTech for good tech info and reviews, not stereotyping anti-American slams.

    Oh, and if I ever do buy an expensive boutique computer system, i hope it DOES come in a big honkin' wooden crate to hopefully survive the journey intact.
    Reply
  • Ninhalem - Monday, April 04, 2011 - link

    Because American packaging is known to be of the highest quality, because if it isn't, you're going to have very irate customers wanting to know why you didn't package their dear products like a Abrams tank. Reply
  • strikeback03 - Monday, April 04, 2011 - link

    Bottom of the page on noise, hat, and power consumption, you say "CyberPower's system has a 4.4GHz overclock and it still manages to keep idle power low by requiring 0.7V less to hit its overclock than the Origin Genesis does. " I assume you meant to say 0.07V? Reply
  • EBH - Monday, April 04, 2011 - link

    For anything more than 1000$ I would expect more than:

    Audio

    Realtek ALC892 HD Audio
    Speaker, mic, line-in, and surround jacks for 7.1 sound
    Digital and optical out
    Reply
  • veri745 - Tuesday, April 05, 2011 - link

    "CyberPower's system has a 4.4GHz overclock and it still manages to keep idle power low by requiring 0.7V less to hit its overclock than the Origin Genesis does."

    I think you probably mean '0.07V less', unless the Cyberpower system is running at 0.72V
    Reply

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