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  • tipoo - Thursday, August 11, 2011 - link

    is it that hard to figure out how to implement higher capacity batteries without them sticking out another inch on the bottom? Reply
  • tipoo - Thursday, August 11, 2011 - link

    Oh and by the way, wasn't a XPS 15Z review coming on Anandtech? When will that be done? Reply
  • Kristian Vättö - Thursday, August 11, 2011 - link

    As far as I know, there are no plans about 15z review, unfortunately :( Or if there is, it's somewhere on Anand's endless to-do list. Reply
  • Anand Lal Shimpi - Thursday, August 11, 2011 - link

    Jarred is working on it, I believe it's one of the next three to be reviewed :)

    Take care,
    Anand
    Reply
  • Wizzdo - Thursday, August 11, 2011 - link

    "but to be honest, it can be very hard to justify the extra $600 for such small differences"

    Resale value.
    Typical Usable Life of Product.
    Virus Immunity.
    Operating System.
    Cost and Headache of O.S. Upgrades.
    Included Software.
    Ease of Backup (Time Machine).
    Lack of Subsidized Crapware.
    Build Quality.
    Support.
    ...

    The 13" MBP trumps in every department. Heck, you'll win on resale alone.
    Reply
  • webdev51 - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    How's that Kool-Aid, Wizzdo?

    Last year I switched to Windows 7 after using two MacBook Pros over 7 years. Here's my opinion:

    Resale value. - I don't use a computer to resell it later. I can get $500 through Apple's recycling program for the $2000 MBP I used two years. BFD.
    Typical Usable Life of Product. - My 2008 MacBook Pro needed its logic board replaced because of the Nvidia problem (TS2377). When I brought it home, the new one needed its logic board replaced too because it had the same problem. Usable life of this computer: 2 years. Very short. It's unreliable.
    Virus Immunity. - I haven't had any problems with viruses on Windows. The only viruses I've had were in data pulled over from my Mac.
    Operating System. - Mac OS X is not special. In fact, it's become quite bloated like Windows. At least Windows's bloat is usable and not lipstick: Mac's full-screen apps?!
    Cost and Headache of O.S. Upgrades. - Insignificant.
    Included Software. - I never used any of the Apple software -- especially Mail because it was very buggy. In fact, good e-mail software was one reason I was looking forward to moving to Windows. I ultimately switched to Thunderbird 3 which I like. TB 2 on Mac (and maybe Windows) wasn't very good from what I recall.
    Ease of Backup (Time Machine). - I wasn't comfortable relying on TM. I like FBackup a lot.
    Lack of Subsidized Crapware. - I didn't get any crapware, but then again I built my own machine. If I bought a machine with Windows installed, I would have just wiped it anyway and reinstalled.
    Build Quality.- See above about Nvidia issue.
    Support. - Yeah, the Genius bar scam artists tried to charge me $300 for a recall. I had to call Apple Tech Support to get a second opinion, and even they suggested I go to another Apple Store, as if I'm supposed to shop around my computer to find out which Apple Store won't screw me over. Then I needed to haul in my own Apple monitor to troubleshoot the issue because they were using a VGA monitor. Their support is crap.

    I'd rather have the $600!
    Reply
  • damianrobertjones - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    Possibly the greatest reply to a mac fan I've ever read. Reply
  • Wizzdo - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    If this is the greatest reply to a "mac fan" than I think PC\Windows is in worse shape than ever.

    "Resale value. - I don't use a computer to resell it later. I can get $500 through Apple's recycling program for the $2000 MBP I used two years. BFD."

    Even in your ignorance of not getting your Mac fixed for free as you were perfectly entitled to (twice), you still got 500$ back from Apple for your old machine. People are getting 60-70% return on two year old macs on EBAY. Try that with your PC.

    Nvidia issue was just that, NVidia's issue. Plagued PC laptops as well. Apple had by far the best replacement policy for it - warranty was extended to 3 years on the GPU. My 2008 MacBook Pro had the issue 5 months ago - fixed for free in a week - 0$. Running better than ever. Sadly, PC users have been having great difficulty getting the PC manufacturers to pony up for this.

    [+1 Apple on support and reliability]

    "I haven't had any problems with viruses on Windows. The only viruses I've had were in data pulled over from my Mac."

    Data is for the most part platform agnostic and ironically the moment the "bad" data got onto Windows than BINGO, you're infected. You also get to burn up your battery and performance with invasive third-party anti-virus programs. MS has a "free" that many to no about one but it is rather lacking in potency.

    [+ 1 Apple virus immunity ]

    "Cost and Headache of O.S. Upgrades. - Insignificant."

    Full version of OS X - 29.99$
    Windows 7 Professional - $199.99$
    ------
    170$ diff

    Leopard -> Lion - 60$ (S.Leopard first)
    XP -> Windows 7 - 400$ (Vista first)
    ------
    340$ diff

    Most Windows users choose to wipe and do a clean install because of the legendary issues often encountered with Windows upgrades.

    OS X upgrade time - ~35 minutes
    Windows ~ 2 hours + 2 hours of patches once booted up

    You get to enjoy Windows invasive copy protection too which all too commonly flags legitimate purchasers as pirates.

    They are not even in the same league in terms of bloat either. Do a little research please.

    I could go on and on on this one...

    [+1 Apple - should be plus +3]

    "If I bought a machine with Windows installed, I would have just wiped it anyway and reinstalled."

    Say no more. [+1 Apple]

    "Ease of Backup (Time Machine). - I wasn't comfortable relying on TM. I like FBackup a lot."

    Again, no comparison in ease of use, performance, reliability or support (none for FBackup). And yet another third-party app you had to research, download, install, learn, setup and hope it actually worked. [+1 Apple]

    Been using Apple Mail for years with no problems. Great application - Windows Mail is not even in the same universe (does anybody actually use it?). Mail in Lion is a really nice upgrade. Thunderbird 3 is a nice third-party email program and runs very well on Mac but the new Mail is soooo much more nicely integrated.

    That's the thing really. Apple continually upgrades and improves their applications along with how they integrate with the OS. They all update automatically and painlessly with Software Update too.

    Nobody uses the built-in apps that come with Windows because they are generally primitive at best and rarely see any upgrades. So instead you get to dig around the internet for days looking for replacements that can hopefully do what you need. Then once you've tried installing, learning and uninstalling 10 different applications and finally settled on one you like than you'll probably have to pay extra for it, constantly monitor it for updates that you need to manually install and pray it works with your next Windows etc. Good Grief. And excellent integration with the OS and other Windows software? Ya, right.

    [+1 Apple]

    You weren't really being serious were you? I sincerely hope not.
    Reply
  • damianrobertjones - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    I would provide a full reply but I'm enjoying life

    Windows gives small companies a chance to sell software while with apple it's their way.

    Neither are better
    Reply
  • Wizzdo - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    I'm glad life is treating you well.

    Funny, Microsoft is the company most demonized and sued for anti-competitive behavior. Just look at the IE mess. Finally, years and years later, Microsoft has released a web browser that is compliant. The suffering they have imposed on web developers is beyond astronomical.

    Apple gives small companies a chance to write high quality software and makes it very easy (app store) and profitable for them to sell it. Many of the best companies (Adobe\Macromedia, Avid etc.) made their mark on the Mac first.

    Yes, Apple has their way and I'm not a fan of how closed iOS is (though I understand the reasons for it). However, "their way" is what makes the platform such a remarkably better overall experience for the average user, makes Apple so successful, and is the reason for the much higher resale value.

    I use, develop for and service Win, Linux and OS X machines daily and the experience and statistics first hand dealing with the customers and their problems paints a very clear picture of who's happy and getting their money's worth.

    I can tell you with great confidence that it definitely ain't the Redmond\PC clients.

    Microsoft does make an excellent database (SQL Server) and their Server OS is pretty good. ASP.Net is a really great web platform and C# is a great language. But the overhead is substantial and none of this technology comes cheap ($$$$$$$$). This is especially true when considering that a MacMini with OS X Server \ LAMP can cover 80% of the same needs for a mere fraction of the cost.

    I like Microsoft and having little control over the hardware their software runs on may be profitable for them - but it is a real "loser's game" for end users in expense, headaches, waste, and lost productivity.
    Reply
  • damianrobertjones - Monday, August 15, 2011 - link

    Funny how Apple now see the need to sue anything that moves.

    Again, you're spending FAR too much time defending a company that will take from you each and every single step of the way.

    ...How about cables changing from ipod version to ipod version.
    Reply
  • webdev51 - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    Yes, I got my MBP repaired *twice* for free -- but not without unnecessary effort.

    Wizzdo, you're not reading what I wrote. They tried to charge me $300 for a free fix. Since they already had my computer, I called them back and they said "Oh, yeah, we'll fix it for free." They did that on purpose; they know what they're doing. They're preying on unsuspecting consumers. Fortunately, I know better. Others don't unfortunately.

    There were too many problems with my experience with Apple and Mac OS X (software selection, software quality) to list here. For one, they had my computer for a month during the repair. I had to borrow a netbook from a relative.

    It's been so much better to build my own machine and to support it myself than to deal with all of the problems I ran into with Apple. Plus with the money I saved building my own desktop, I could buy a laptop for the few times I needed to be portable.

    Fortunately I am able to build and support my own machine. I feel for those who are not able to do that and must deal with Apple. Even people with similar problems to mine are still buying Macs, I guess because, understandably, they feel they don't have any choice:

    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=d1fa1...
    Reply
  • webdev51 - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    Yes, I got my MBP repaired *twice* for free -- but not without unnecessary effort. They tried to charge me $300 for a free fix. Since they already had my computer, I called them back and they said "Oh, yeah, we'll fix it for free." They did that on purpose; they know what they're doing. They're preying on unsuspecting consumers. Fortunately, I know better. Others don't unfortunately.

    There were too many problems with my experience with Apple and Mac OS X (software selection, software quality) to list here. For one, they had my computer for a month during the repair. I had to borrow a netbook from a relative.

    It's been so much better to build my own machine and to support it myself than to deal with all of the problems I ran into with Apple. Plus with the money I saved building my own desktop, I could buy a laptop for the few times I needed to be portable.

    Fortunately I am able to build and support my own machine. I feel for those who are not able to do that and must deal with Apple. Even people with similar problems to mine are still buying Macs, I guess because, understandably, they feel they don't have any choice.
    Reply
  • damianrobertjones - Monday, August 15, 2011 - link

    Windows Live essentials. Reply
  • damianrobertjones - Friday, August 12, 2011 - link

    Where are the reviews? If this were a mac.... etc rant usual fanboy talk.

    P.s. I've ordered the Vostro 131 with the celeron and will post my findings on the Notebook review forum once done.
    Reply

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