Mobile Buyer's Guide

by Jarred Walton on July 11, 2008 12:00 AM EST

A Few Words about Graphics

We haven't dwelt much on the topic of gaming laptops so far, and with good reason. The less expensive notebooks that come with discrete graphics may try to pass themselves off as being game worthy, but the truth is most laptops that don't cost over $2000 aren't going to have sufficient graphics power to run a lot of modern 3D titles without seriously decreasing the detail settings. The "midrange" mobile graphics solutions like the HD 2600 and GeForce 8600M might at first glance seem reasonable, but they're more for multimedia and fall short of being true gaming solutions. You really need to get into the 8800M series to get relatively high mobile graphics performance. Let's dig a little deeper to find out why.

NVIDIA has a lot of overlapping product names that can create some confusion, so let's take a minute to go through them all. The GeForce 8600M GS is a 16 SP solution that will struggle with modern games at moderate resolutions (1280x800) unless you turn down some details; the 8400M GS and 8400M GT also have 16 SPs but with 66% and 75% of the clock speed of the 8600M GS. The GS also cuts the memory bus in half (64-bit), which further reduces performance. The 8400M G is the bottom of the discrete mobile solutions, with only 8 SPs and a 64-bit memory bus. Despite the similar name, the 8600M GT is about 50% faster (32 SPs), and the 8700M GT is a ~30% higher clocked version of the 8600M GT. Confused yet? We're not even half way through the list!

In recent months, NVIDIA launched their 9M series of mobile GPUs. While you might expect them to be newer and therefore faster, looking at the specs it seems as if many of the parts are merely renamed 8M solutions. The 9300M G has the same specs as the 8400M GS, the 9500M GS looks the same as the 8600M GT, and the 9650M GS is the same as the 8700M GT. Well, core clocks, shader clocks, and RAM clocks are all the same at least. It's not entirely clear right now, but some of the 9M parts may be manufactured on a 55nm process instead of a 65nm or 80nm process - NVIDIA hasn't really clarified this point. While the 9M parts at first glance seem like rebadged 8M chips, there is one difference: the 9M parts (well, at least some of them) also have the latest VP3 video processing engine compared to VP2 on the 8M chips. How much that matters will depend on how important you feel Blu-ray decode acceleration is.

Wrapping things up, we still have the highest performing NVIDIA solutions: the 8800M GTS and the 8800M GTX, with 64 and 96 SPs respectively plus a 256-bit memory interface. With two or three times the number of SPs as the next tier of NVIDIA chips, plus roughly twice the memory bandwidth, there's a huge performance gap. The 8800M GTS ends up being about 80% faster than the 8700M GT, and the 8800M GTX improves on that by another 30% or so. To put all this in perspective, the 8800M GTX is still about 20% slower than a single 8800 GT 512MB desktop. Now, while the 8800 GT was a great card when it launched, there are certainly a lot of titles where it struggles at higher detail settings and resolutions… which is why we now have $200 9800 GTX cards.

And if all this discussion of mobile NVIDIA GPUs isn't already enough to make your head spin, the 8800M series is about due for replacement by a 9800 class GPU. We don't have specifics on clock speeds or number of SPs, but there are plenty of early images on the web showing upcoming laptops with 9800M GTX or 9800M GTS graphics. It's a safe bet that both will be faster than current generation 8800M parts; we'll have to wait for additional details on process technology, power requirements, SPs, and clock speeds.

Update: It appears some information is already available on additional NVIDIA mobile chips, specifically we have the 9700M GT, 9700M GTS, 9800M GT, 9800M GTS, and 9800M GTX. I have added a third NVIDIA table listing these products, based on the information on the linked pages (which may go away shortly). These parts should fill in a the gap between the 9650M GS/8700M GT and the 8800M GTS.

ATI's side of the mobile graphics equation isn't quite as confusing, as we don't have as many overlapping parts. ATI mobile solutions are also not quite as prevalent these days for whatever reason. We still have the HD 2000 and HD 3000 series of cards, but we have not yet seen any notebooks with the top-end 3850/3870 solutions. That means that the best ATI gaming laptops end up falling short of the 8800M NVIDIA options.

To quickly summarize things, we've put together a couple tables. NVIDIA has so many options that we split their table into a lower and upper tier of performance. We have only included DirectX 10 capable parts, and we arranged the tables in order of roughly increasing performance. We also omitted the IGP solutions; the best of these is the ATI Radeon HD 3200 found in the 780G, but it only barely outpaces the bottom discrete solutions.





In terms of comparing ATI to NVIDIA, the desktop arena is a pretty good indication of the mobile landscape. The 3650 goes up against the 8600M/8700M and should be competitive with the 8600M GT and GS while losing to the 8700M; the 3450 will compete with the 8400M, and it's probably close enough to call it a draw - though performance will be around half of 3650/8600M. It's also worth noting that the HD 2600 and 3650 offer roughly the same performance, and likewise the 2400 and 3450 should be pretty similar. Like NVIDIA, the newer GPUs seem to primarily target better HD video decoding. If you want something better than an IGP solution, we'd recommend getting at least one of the 32 SP NVIDIA solutions or one of the 120 SP ATI solutions.

Entry-Level Laptops Midrange Laptops
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  • theoflow - Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - link

    I know this is pretty much covered in the first line of this article, but I'm dying to see the new desktop system build guides.

    I've been out of system building for about 3 years and I'm somewhat clueless as to what direction I should go.

    ARG!!!

    LOL
  • Rekonn - Sunday, July 27, 2008 - link

    "we understand the P-6860 is scheduled to be replaced in the future by another slightly upgraded model"

    Anybody know details on this?
  • JarredWalton - Sunday, July 27, 2008 - link

    Yes but it's under NDA. I can tell you next month, and trust me you'll be impressed (again).
  • Rekonn - Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - link

    Sweet, looking forward to it.
  • Rekonn - Monday, August 4, 2008 - link

    Think I found it, the Gateway P-7811 FX. Available on August 14th for $1500.
    http://laptopcom.blogspot.com/2008/08/gateway-p-78...">http://laptopcom.blogspot.com/2008/08/g...y-p-7811...

    Now, how much better is a 9800GTS vs an 8800 GTS?
  • JonnyDough - Saturday, July 12, 2008 - link

    I have a hard time with believing that the "mid-ranged" notebooks are between $1500 and $1750. It's like you pulled these numbers out of thin air and you neglected the $1K-1.5K segment altogether. $1K is where a decent modern laptop starts. Anything pushing $1500 is too much for many people to bother spending, while $1K is about right. I just got a Dell flier, the multi-page one with desktops in it too. The majority or main line notebooks start at $999, like the Inspiron. Granted, you can add options for a hundred here or there, but the starting price is $999 on a few different lines of their notebooks. I would have to say that this is the "mid-range" as they show a $999er right on the front page. You can shop NewEgg and find decent laptops that are older processors and so on for $500ish. So saying that $1500-$1750 is "mid-range" is complete bullocks. Mid-range is the budget minded market segment that wants something just a bit better than the bare minimum and it's what Dell caters to and always has. The mass market. Mid-range = mass market. Period. There's no argument against it. Budget does not = mass market. Budget = budget = those that have to watch every dollar. Remember mainstream America? Remember those that pinch pennies but still go to the fair? Yeah, us. The middle income folks. The majority of America does not live in poverty, yet. Thanks.
  • JonnyDough - Saturday, July 12, 2008 - link

    Eek! They edited the article right after I posted. LOL
  • JarredWalton - Sunday, July 13, 2008 - link

    Um... no, we didn't. I had budget, then Entry-level, then Midrange, then High-end, then Dream since the beginning. As I mention in the intro, the price brackets are indeed somewhat arbitrary with plenty of overlap. I may call $1000 "entry" and $1500 "midrange", but regardless of the name I did my best to cover all bases from $300 up through $5000. As I mention on the Entry-Level page, $1000 will get you a LOT of laptop, and unless you want gaming (i.e. Gateway P-6860) a lot of people can stop right there - give or take $250.
  • Jjoshua2 - Saturday, July 12, 2008 - link

    I think the 6-cell Wind is pretty cool. I pre-ordered one from buy.com and I was able to use a coupon that got me $15 off. Now I just hope it will get in-stock soon.
  • fabarati - Saturday, July 12, 2008 - link

    Besides warranties, this article lacked Two major points that are often overlooked - and one not quite as oftenly overlooked -when shopping for laptops: Build, Screen and Battery.

    Build quality is very different from laptop to laptop. Generally business lines are better built than consumer lines, which are better build than budget lines. There are laptops that are built better than consumer laptops, but worse than business ones, etc. That's why a same specced Thinkpad T61 is more expensive than a HP DV6700 (typical consumer build quality) or any acer (crappy budget build). Or why a an XPS m1530 is a better buy than an Asus M50/51

    Screen is also overlooked. Nearly all laptop screens are horrible compared to desktops. They're all TN screens. The very, very best are at about desktop mid-range TN's level.

    Batterylife depends on more than just what specifications a computer and the battery has. It also depends on ACPI and bios coding, and what and how good the batterysaving applications that come with are. Almost ny new Asus (Santa Rosa or newer), with a few exceptions like the U2e, has horrible batterylife. Some have a hard time reaching 2 hours under normal usage.

    Then there are some small stuff that nagged me about this article, mainly performance things. Whilst the HD3650/9500m GS/8600m GT/HD2600 are not really powerful, even when not compared to desktop midrange alternatives, they are possible to game on. In fact, you'll get a pretty decent gaming experience, and it'll be portable. They are just usually run on lower resolutions (because many laptops they're in have lower resolutions) and lower (medium) settings. The fact that they can't run a game on all high does not make it un-gameable.

    Anywho, you guys didn't do too many mistakes, and had some Ok recomendations. Pretty good for beginners.

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