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  • Chaitanya - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Probably the most useless upgrade in recent years for PC users.
  • Sabresiberian - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    1) This is only an optimization of an existing architecture, and

    2) Anyone knowledgeable will almost always recommend skipping at least one architectural generation and, especially considering the slow improvements over the last 5 years, at least 2 generations. Which means if you are in a use-case scenario that can take advantage of the increased CPU performance you shouldn't be thinking "upgrade" unless you are running Sandy Bridge or earlier.

    (The obvious exception that breaks the rule here is Zen, which will offer a huge performance increase over Bulldozer.)
  • Shadow7037932 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    >(The obvious exception that breaks the rule here is Zen, which will offer a huge performance increase over Bulldozer.)

    How about we wait until it's actually released? Remember what happened with the original Phenom?
  • silverblue - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    I don't think it's unreasonable to get excited about Zen, at least in terms of AMD's current product lines. Potentially massively optimised benchmarks aside, at least they tested Ryzen engineering samples against Intel's more expensive offerings in public without resorting to slides containing unsubstantiated performance claims. In fact, the only thing I can see in print is the "40% faster than Excavator" claim. If the Canard PC leaks aren't fake, there's every chance that AMD have achieved this, and possibly exceeded it.

    You mentioned Phenom, so let's take a trip down memory lane:

    Phenom: "40% faster than Core 2 Quad at the same clock speed"
    Reality: Up to 40% slower per clock after the TLB bug; needed Phenom II to really close the gap.

    Bulldozer: "50% faster than the i7 950"
    Reality: In what test? Even the 8350 couldn't boast this.

    I don't see Ryzen being the gaming top dog - remember, current productivity and gaming demos have been against slower clocked CPUs with double the cores of your garden variety, highly clocked i5 and i7 - but I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that it'll bury the FX series. IMHO, of course.
  • boozed - Friday, January 6, 2017 - link

    I think the problem is that if Skylake wasn't enough of a performance improvement to upgrade, neither is Kaby Lake.
  • Murloc - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    is it?
    I'm running a nehalem, if I was upgrading now I'd appreciate the lower power consumption and the HEVC hardware support.
  • willis936 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    Was HEVC hardware not present on the 6x00 series?
  • Shadow7037932 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    He said Nehalem, which is the i7 920 and the like.
  • close - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    @Shadow7037932, can you name one good reason why he should update his Nehalem to a Kaby Lake K part that didn't exist one and a half years ago with Skylake?

    I'll put it another way: If someone passed on a Skylake upgrade last year why exactly would they pay the same price to get a pre-overclocked Skylake (aka Kaby Lake) this year? Why did the user suffer through an extra ~18 months of really aging hardware just to buy what's basically the same CPU at the same price today?

    Since these 2 generations share architecture and fabrication process there's no reason to expect consistently better OC on the 7 series. So the 300MHz should be within reach for any K part and any user.
  • MonkeyPaw - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Looks like it is the best 14nm Intel architecture you can buy. Still, it seems like if you're in the market now, you might as well wait to see if Ryzen will be a compelling option. If nothing else it might help drive some of these prices down.
  • Obviously Dead - Wednesday, July 26, 2017 - link

    Depends. For me it's the best yet, since I'm upgrading from an E5400.
  • Dr. Swag - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Hey Ian, where's the 6700k in these benchmarks? It's in the 7700k review but not the 7600k review :/
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    What benefit does this bring to me?

    A fresh install of Windows XP-SP2 boots in 3 seconds on my 35 watt Sandy Bridge

    I can block NSA and FBI malware on XP but not on Windows Spyware Platform 10

    For audio production, I can record what I hear in XP but not in 7/8 or 10

    I can still boot to 10 if I want malware and spyware relabeled as DRM but I haven't had a Blue Screen of death in over 10 years now with XP-SP2 and I do not get persistent malware, so......

    What's the point of getting this new chip ?

    Why pay more to be limited as to what I can do with "MY" computer?

    I'm not trolling
    It's a serious question

    So answer it honestly without the attacks (Crayons)

    Why downgrade to an OS that limits what you can do on a hardware platform that also limits what you can run?
  • Eletriarnation - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    If you're running Windows XP on Sandy Bridge, it's my guess that Intel isn't really targeting your use case and maybe you shouldn't be surprised that you see no benefit in upgrading.
  • Murloc - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    if you are so concerned with this stuff and security, why don't you use open source software so you can be sure of what it does?
    Then you'd be able to get all the benefits of modern OSes (which are many compared to XP) without the spyware.
  • Ninhalem - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Just stop. You're trolling. This is the same comment in the Kaby Lake i7 article. Your usage scenario is beyond minuscule compared to every other mainstream and enterprise system.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    Ninhalem
    Presenting FACTS regarding these chips and how they can and cannot be used is not trolling

    I can provide all the evidence needed to show anyone how to lock down XP to a VERY secure state

    I cannot do the same for Windows 7/8 or 10 due to the malware and spyware that Microsoft calls DRM to get around the Law for the purpose of committing what are considered Very serious crimes if done by you or me

    If you wish to reproduce my results, I can show you how but this is NOT trolling

    Only negative responses to my posts without any evidence or effort given to reproduce my results are from Trolls

    Read replies by Crayons for trolling examples
    He is a Pro!
  • lopri - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    You piqued my interest. Is there something I can look up as to how to lock down XP to a secure state?
  • jimbo2779 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    The power button is quite useful for keeping XP secure.

    Seriously though, the guy is trolling, to what ends I do not know, but his use case apparently has no need for any of the multitude of improvements brought in from vista onwards.

    From what I gather from all his posts all he wants to do is test malware and prove his locked down XP is secure. Personally I use my system for much more and don't remember the last ti.e I caught any kind if malware infection so have no need to stay shackled by an out dated OS.

    To each their own I guess
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    lopri
    Is there something I can look up as to how to lock down XP to a secure state?
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    yes, you can read my posts and try what I have done for yourself so you have your own evidence instead of believing the majority voice at every turn and finding your computer can never be secured

    or, you can choose to believe Microsoft and continue to think that DRM opening backdoors into your system is a good thing and is keeping you safe by watching everything you do to ....
    A. Protect You?
    or
    B. Protect a Monopoly that cannot be overturned because protecting MY right to privacy is in direct violation of the Laws the Monopoly created to prevent me from defeating "their" DRM

    I say it is B.
    The only way they can survive is by preventing me from doing what they are doing ensuring their own survival at my expense

    I do not recognize their (your) Laws or their (your) License

    I will continue to violate any Law or License that grants anyone rights that they choose to deny me

    So to humor me for the Lulz is a waste of time

    but you already knew that
  • FourEyedGeek - Tuesday, January 10, 2017 - link

    Wow, such a rebel, you are inspiring!
  • pentiuman - Sunday, March 26, 2017 - link

    I agree w/ Bullwinkle! I have referred to this website occasionally, but just joined this website to make this post. I have 2 systems, and the older one runs a Core2-quad Q6600 - that idles under 5 % usage, according to Task Manager! It's on both Windows XP and Windows 7 on seperate HD's. I really like my XP install for several reasons: 1. My old HP Laser printer works w/ it, 2. XP doesn't take up much space - I have dozens of programs installed on a 120GB drive. 3. It is very familiar to previous Window versions, so I don't have to learn even more new ways just to do the same tasks. 4. Although Microsoft left us w/ no further updates, XP's support by hardware manufacturers continue! Next time you're at a tech store, read the driver compatibilities. 5. Although I use mainly CD's, I have more digital music rights and options! 6. WinXP works w/ my backup software, my Microsoft Office suites, and old games. 7. Despite what Microsoft wants you to believe, an up to date antivirus program, reasonably careful Internet-based program usage, and customized program installs, means I hardly ever have any virus or malware issues.
    - Microsoft is up to something, when they give away Windows 10, and prevent us from using anything but Windows 10, starting w/ Kaby Lake and AMD Ruyzen. Why? Question authority.
  • MonkeyPaw - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    You are using an operating system that has been EOLed on hardware that has been EOLed. Besides, XP was the first OS to start phoning home, so you might want to hunt down a copy of Windows 2000.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    MonkeyPaw

    Volume Licensed copies of XP-SP1 did not contain the Phone Home activation DRM and could easily be slipstreamed to SP2 or SP3 versions

    Any remaining microsoft components could easily be blocked with an aftermarket firewall so there is really no need for Windows 2000 just to avoid phoning home

    End of Life for XP is the day I can no longer block a persistent threat

    End of Life for 7/8 and 10 is the day they were released as I still cannot block the persistent threats imposed by the weaponized spyware and malware that Microsoft simply calls DRM for Legal Reasons
  • Achaios - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    Dear, Bullwinkle J Moose, since you are so concerned with NSA snooping on you, I'd like to inform you that North Korea and China are the two regions of the world where Windows XP is the most widely used operating system.

    I don't even need to explain to you why NK and China are prime targets of electronic surveillance and espionage by the US of A and other actors. That means, Windows XP is the worse operating system to run as almost every single espionage tool in the US arsenal is made specifically to target Windows XP PC's, amongst other OS' and so-called "unknown" OS'.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    Dear Achaios
    every single espionage tool in the US arsenal will fail on a Windows XP box that is set up properly and used in the same manner

    It takes a lot of research to get it right and have reliable/repeatable results and it is not recommended for all the wannabe experts at this site, but the results speak for themselves

    NO persistent threat has been found that can wreck this XP installation and I check out new threats quite often

    It is a read only OS when using Driveshield
    Flash and java are disabled and Silverlight and Net Framework are not allowed!
    Everything including the antivirus is blocked from sending or receiving in the aftermarket firewall
    Only a secure browser is allowed Internet access
    Nothing is allowed to update over the Internet!
    If I need AV updates, I download the complete updated installer to a clean system and install it offline
    Portable utilities are available to close most remaining security vulnerabilities quickly

    It is not used for banking or other sensitive input
    That's what a fresh copy of Linux LIVE is for!

    But it is great for studying malware/extortionware and any other threats without getting hosed by the worst of the worst hackers on the planet

    It is SAFE for what it does!

    For other things (gaming or banking), I have several other operating systems on several thumbdrives, hard drives and SSD's

    I can switch eSATA and USB drives quickly while rebooting and never rely on dualboot drives for reliability purposes

    Leaving 1st boot drive blank in the BIOS means it will just boot to whatever drive is connected (SATA OR USB)
  • maximumGPU - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    let me get this right. You have a severely locked down EOL OS that has very limited usability except for niche things like studying malware and you're claiming kaby lake is a waste of money because you can't make it work on that os?
    hope this will help:
    INTEL AND THE REST OF THE WORLD DOESN'T CARE ABOUT YOUR USE CASE, THIS PRODUCT IS NOT INTENDED FOR YOU.

    ps: i seriously doubt any foreign government gives a sh*t about your pron viewing habits either. Stop trolling.
  • Shadow7037932 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    >every single espionage tool in the US arsenal will fail on a Windows XP box that is set up properly and used in the same manner

    If you believe that, I got a bridge to sell you...
  • tech6 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    @Bullwinkle Moose: If you're still running Windows XP then you are so vulnerable that you are not blocking ANY malware, let alone state sponsored players.
  • close - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    @Bullwinkle J Moose, I have an XP that I desperately want to keep using but I need assistance in securing it. Mind if you give me a hint with what you've done? I run SP3 but if needed I can upgrade to SP2.
  • Gastec - Wednesday, January 11, 2017 - link

    I remember that when Windows XP came out, more than 15 years ago, eveybody was crying out loud (some hysterically) that Windows 98 is waaay better and they will never upgrade to XP.
    But enough about operating systems, that discussion is irrelevant. I'm more interested in learning about the things (voices?) that YOU HEAR and record :)
  • serpretetsky - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Maybe I went over the article too fast, is there something specific about this chip to windows 10?
  • nico_mach - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Speedstep is unique to Windows 10.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    probably not but do any of the motherboards support IDE ?

    Does the chip itself have XP drivers?

    Probably not

    Waste of money
  • Murloc - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    if you don't like windows you can use linux.

    With XP you're not getting the most recent versions of directx anyway so you're probably not gaming on it, so what's the reason for sticking to windows?
  • doggface - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    Seriously... Wow. Troll much.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    never
  • Shadow7037932 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    Loss of $500-1K from you is not a big deal for Intel or any other OEM.
  • Outlander_04 - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Looks like intel are worried about Zen enough they have bumped up stock clocks .
    They have achieved that with out too much extra power consumption which is something I guess , but kaby lake is not a step forward
  • Murloc - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    optimization is just that, why would we expect something more?
  • lopri - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    It's not Zen but it's their own chips of the past years. They even admit that the IPC is unchanged from Sky Lake, so the only way to sell this chip as something new is by jacking up the "official" clock frequency.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    How is preventing anyone from securing their own computer an upgrade?

    How is limiting what you can do on your computer an upgrade?

    It is now legal for the FBI to hack into ANY computer ANYWHERE as long as you are using Windows 7/8 or 10, but I can stop them with XP

    So how is this an Upgrade?

    Security trumps your definition of "upgrade"
  • Murloc - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    they don't prevent you from using linux, BSD or even your own custom OS and securing your computer.
  • jimbo2779 - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    What does any of this or your other posts have anything to do with the processor reviewed.

    Can you go post this in a comment section about win vista - 10 so the rest of us aren't subjected to it.

    This article is about a cup not Windows.

    Thanks.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    because Windows XP IS Secure if you know what you're doing!

    and my Windows software IS compatible with Windows, not Linux
  • eldakka - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    And most software that requires windows XP and is on 10-year old hardware will run just fine under an emulation environment (e.g. wine) on Linux. Or even inside a Windows XP VM running on a linux host OS.

    Emulation is of course much slower than native, but running an emulator on current generation hardware will still be faster than running native on that 10-year old hardware.

    That way you can get a modern operating system with support for modern hardware, without the windows 8/10 spyware, while still being able to run your old winXP apps.

    But if you have no desire or need to get a modern OS, if you are happy with XP and the performance that you get on your current hardware, then why the hell are you even asking these questions and looking here? The only reason you'd be looking and asking these questions is if you are interested in upgrading.
  • Bullwinkle J Moose - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    you sound confused eldakka
    what exactly is your point of running a secure OS from within a spyware platform with backdoored bitlocker encryption, keylogger, DRM and Windows components you cannot block in your firewall ?

    It is TRUE that Windows 10 is the most secure Version of Windows EVER, but Microsoft should finish the sentence.....

    Windows 10 is the most secure Version of spyware EVER for the FBI and the NSA, but NOT the End Loser (er...user)

    Funny how the Snowden Interview video disapeared from the Internet explaining how he could watch you as you type and edit your text at your computer BEFORE you send the message with your "secure" encrypted messaging app

    Those backdoors are there for a reason.....To spy on and hack any "modern" Windows Computer in the World which is why MS had to kill XP and why the Law was changed to allow the FBI to hack ANY computers, anywhere with a single warrant (that went into affect December 1st)

    The FBI could not do that if the back doors were closed, but you cannot close them on Windows 10
    computers

    But the REAL Trolls here won't discuss that now will they?
  • Dug - Thursday, January 19, 2017 - link

    Because no one cares about your AWESOME Windows XP! Get of the Internets everyone!!!! OMG, Spy FBI CIA NSA HELPS ME!!!

    Really dude, you are awesome. Thanks for repeating the same crap over and over again and showing your real ignorance. If you really knew what you were doing, you wouldn't have to explain yourself.
  • Dug - Thursday, January 19, 2017 - link

    And if you have SUPER SECRETS that you don't want anyone to know about, guess what?
    Don't go online? You do realize that just having any port open allows someone to see your packets. You really think your ISP is secure? Because once a packet leaves your house, it's not your network anymore.

    If any of the mentioned entities really want information from you, they'll just come in and physically take it.
  • 137ben - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    The most secure operating system is one which allows for no input and gives no output. At that point, it's not a computer.
  • Magichands8 - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    This Optane looks completely useless. But Optane DRAM sounds like it could be interesting. Depending upon how much slower it is.
  • lopri - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    I immediately thought of "AMD Memory" which AMD launched after the Bulldozer flop. But then again Intel have been going after this storage caching scheme for years now and I do not think it has taken them anywhere.
  • smilingcrow - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Games frame rates to 2 decimal points adds nothing but making it harder to scan the numbers quickly. Enough already.
  • 1_rick - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    One place where the extra threads of an i7 are useful is if you're using VMs (maybe to run a database server or something.) I've found that an i5 with 8GB can get bogged down pretty drastically just from running a VM.
  • Meteor2 - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    I kinda think that if you're running db VMs on an i7, you're doing it wrong.
  • t.s - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    or if you're Android developer using Android Studio.
  • lopri - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    That is true but as others have implied you can get 6 or 8 real core Xeons for cheaper than these new Kaby Lake chips if VM is what you need the performance of a CPU is for.
  • ddhelmet - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Well I am more glad now that I got a Skylake. Even if I waited for this the performance increase is not worth it.
  • Kaihekoa - Tuesday, January 3, 2017 - link

    Y'all need to revise your game benchmarking analysis. At least use some current generation GPUs, post the minimum framerates, and test at 1440p. The rest of your review is exceptional, but the gaming part needs some modernization, please.
  • lopri - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    I thank the author for a clear yet thorough review. A lot of grounds are covered and the big picture of the chip's performance and features is well communicated. I agree with the author's recommendation at the end as well. I have not felt that I am missing out anything compared to i7's while running a 2500K for my gaming system, and unless you know for certain that you can take advantage of HyperThreading, spending the difference in dollars toward an SSD or a graphics card is a wiser expenditure that will provide you with better computing experience.

    Having said that, I am wtill not compelled to upgrade my 2500K which has been running at 4.8 GHz for years. (It does 5.0 GHz no problem but I run it at 4.8 to leave some "headroom") While I think the 7600K is barely a worthy upgrade (finally!) on its own light, but the added cost cannot be overlooked. A new motherboard, new memory, and potentially a new heat sink will quickly add to the budget, and I am not sure if it is going to be worth all the expenses that will follow.

    Of course all that could be worthwhile if overclocking was fun, but Intel pretty much have killed overclocking and the overclocking community. Intentionally if I might add. Today overclocking does not give one a sense of discovery or accomplishment. Competition between friendly enthusiasts or hostile motherboard/memory vendors has disappeared. Naturally there is no accumulation or exchange of knowledge in the community, and conversations have become frustrating and vain due to lack of overclocking expertise. Only some brute force overclocking with dedicated cooling has some following, and the occasional "overclocking" topics in the forums are really a braggadocio in disguise, of which the competition underneath is really about who spent the most on their rigs with the latest blingy stuff. Needless to say those are not as exciting or illuminating as the real overclocking of the yore, and in my opinion there are better ways to spend money for such a self-gratification without the complication that often accompanies overclocking which in the end fails to impress.

    Intel might have a second thought about its overclocking policies now, but just as many things Intel have done in recent years, it is too little too late. And their chips have no headroom anyway. My work system is due for an upgrade and I am probably going to pick up a couple of E2670s which will give me 16 real cores for less than $200. Why bother with the new stuff when the IPC gain is meager and there is no fun in overclocking? And contribute to Intel's revenue? Thank you but no thank you.

    P.S. Sorry I meant to commend the author for the excellent (albeit redundant) review but ended up ranting about something else. Oh well, carry on..
  • solnyshok - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    7350K seems like a good old overcloking fun CPU. Introduced just ahead of Ryzen launch. Taking this one from 4.2 to 5GHz is a good +20% overclock. And good (not incredible) value at $175. This or its successor on 10nm will be my next gaming machine.
  • skpetic - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    1. Aggregated results are that an i7-6700 is as fast as the i5-7600K(?)
    2. The 6700 is more future proof as it has better performance in applications with good multithreading implementations (future apps and games)
    3. Why is this not considered in the review?
  • Anato - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    Had I known this in 2011 when I bought i5-2500k I would have purchased i7-2600k for hyperthreading as it helps in spice simulations. I also would have spend 100$ more to better modo. On the other hand I saved 200$+interest not doing so...

    I'm almost happy that advancement in performance has slowed down. No need to upgrade and finally we are seeing software being optimized. Like Chrome browser, we wouldn't see these java script competitions if never hardware would be suffice.
  • masouth - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    In the 5th paragraph you have the 7600K as 4.0 base/ 4.2 turbo but in the table it is listed as 3.8 base/ 4.2 turbo
  • pavag - Wednesday, January 4, 2017 - link

    I cannot find the log out link
  • zodiacfml - Thursday, January 5, 2017 - link

    Not surprised.
  • inmytaxi - Friday, January 6, 2017 - link

    Why is the ivy bridge you are using the 3770k, an i7, instead of an i5 3570k? Don't you think people considering the i5 are more likely to have ... AN IFIVE@!!!!
  • Adam Saint - Saturday, January 7, 2017 - link

    Looks like the 4790k is holding up exceptionally well in both single and multithreaded tests. Impressive for a chip that's 3 generations old.
  • epobirs - Sunday, January 15, 2017 - link

    I build new systems as a hobby, so I'm not especially concerned with whether the new box is a sufficient upgrade over my current main system. That my next build can have some incremental improvements at about the same price point is real progress in my book. Right now, I have a pair of Antec mITX cases I got especially cheap. The original purpose they were intended to serve has been cancelled, so some HTPC configurations are likely, just for the fun of it. since some of Kaby Lakes upgrades are directly applicable to an HTPC's needs, those are likely the parts I'll use if no Skylake items become available for an especially good price.

    In general, incremental upgrades of the product line don't offend me any more than minor improvements to an automobile model from one year to the next. Just because I'm not in the market for a new car this year doesn't mean they should hold still. There are plenty of others who are more than due for an upgrade and those incremental improvements add up eventually for everybody.
  • snapch23 - Friday, December 29, 2017 - link

    It is good that we know so much of the gta. http://mygtacheats.com

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